/shudder indeed

Huh, the lyrcis to Star Spangled Banner seemed to have changed since I moved out of the US. Doomed to repeat history indeed.

A fine singing voice, I have to say. The argument behind it, I'm less sure about. One can just as well note that Jefferson cut the Bible to pieces to remove all the mystical stuff, or that Ben Franklin (and many other Founding Fathers) weren't really Christians.

I always preferred Casablanca's use of La Marseilles for jingoistic propaganda purposes, though. No one can make a song about the watering the fields with the blood of invaders and traitors sound so rousing as the French.

I think I love you even more for posting this. You are my hero in so many ways.

What embarrasses me so completely is that this man was a Marine.

The crazies were always such a small population in the Corps, but they existed. When Promise-Keepers became big, there were a few of those. I was embarrassed to know a couple.

The infamous line that 'there are no Atheists in a foxhole' is pure propaganda, however. Most of us are.

But those few crazies sure are loud.

OMG, that was my first thought when seeing that clip. I was waiting for the crowd to join in just like they did in the movie.

But I will give it to the crazy teabagger, he did have a very fine voice.

What I wonder is how many Tea Party supporters actually have thought through the importance of the separation of church and state.

The alternative is having an official state religion, presumably with the federal government in charge of determining what is and isn't Christian.

If you are in favor of reducing government interference in people's lives you should be all for the separation of church and state.

So, you're buying into the Mainstream's demonization of the Tea Party, that was hijacked by the Right Wing? The Tea Party was founded by Moderates and Libertarians, Ron Paul, with many roots right here in Texas for one thing.

Yes, forgetting history indeed is the problem. Forgetting American history for one thing, and allowing lunatics in both "Major" parties to continue to play this tennis match with our beliefs, individual rights and freedoms and the Republic.

God is mentioned in American the Beautiful, too. What shall we do? We could always get Beyonce to write us a new secular Hip-hop anthem or maybe find a good atheist to do the job. Then what would this solve? We would infuriate and alienate all the people that do believe in God and the arguments go on and on.

Being American means dealing with being offended by Free Speech, the beliefs of others, books, music et al. It means living in danger because Freedom by its very nature is a dangerous business. We should not be allowing powers disguised as protections to strip us of our Rights, no matter how dire the consequences might seem, because I can assure you, most of what has been done already in less than a decade following 9-11 haven't been done so much for the poor 3rd World victims of our Military Industrial Complex as they have been put into place to quell us, the American People, now and in the future. That is, if we let them continue.

The long and the short of things, if Americans do not start worrying more about the United States as a Nation and learn to find what's the common ground among us all -- if we do not learn to stop allowing this out-of-control Federal Government from constantly pushing us into a Racial Divide (all for political gains) -- we are done for as a Republic.

The Global Government won't be like the Federation in Star Trek, folks. Would be nice, but history shows us what tyrants do with ultimate power and if we let the sovereignty of the U.S. drop into the oceans all in the name of Political Correctness, aspiring to more lies about "Hope & Change" or "WMDs", we are deserving of no Freedom at all.

As Ben Franklin was asked so long ago: "What have we got, a republic or a monarchy?"

"A republic if you can keep it," responded Franklin.

I think the criticism here is a bit overblown. Its distressing that people are so quick to condemn the other side's extremes but are so blind to their own. Honestly, comparing the singing of the national anthem, even one of the secondary verses with its jingoism, to Nazi propaganda is overly dramatic.

It's troubling to me that people are so quick to demonize and dehumanize their opponents.(comparing peaceful demonstrators to Nazis and calling them teabaggers does both). Don't misunderstand me, there is plenty of this coming from the right as well, but that does not make it OK for the left to do it.

Being patriotic and conservative does not make one crazy. Neither does being progressive.

"Smaller government" doesn't really mesh with "using government to force your religion on others." Nice job by the teabaggers of maintaining a perfect zero on credibility...

Speaking of bitch, that one reminded me of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2n9lIrT7aM

One of the finest moments in movie history. :)

Actually the separation of church and state came about *with* christianity "Then give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's.". Not always respected but it's spelled very clearly there.

Before, both in Greece and in Rome one had to follow the religion of the state or risk being tried ('empiety' was a crime) in Rome's case it was mandatory to sacrifice to the Emperor, that's why many christians went under trial for 'atheism'.

I really need to stop reading this blog. It makes me want to stop buying your books.

I'm with saxster and bellerophon9. And yes, I watched both clips all the way through.

I don't have a problem with your views and politics, but it's how you go about expressing them. The elitist, condescending, snarky attitude doesn't sit well with me. I guess it's not likely that you care but I figured I'd post anyway. Same reason I can't stand Le Show.

I'm a little right of center. But that doesn't mean that I think everyone to the left is an idiot for being so. It'd be nice to be treated the same by someone who appears to be intelligent and courteous person by all other counts.

Its dangerous to compare to the Nazis in this matter, because any nationalist could be compared the Nazis, and not every nationalist is bad. Nationalism can be very productive when channeled correctly.

The Nazi characteristic that scares me about the tea party is the whole 'you ain't christian, you ain't american' gig. That sure doesn't look good.

Though hey, any contender in the two-party is system is good news by my book. Monopolies are bad for the people.

I don't even need to see the second one. ity's too obvious. 'Tomorrow Belongs to Me'.
Thank feck these fools don't have a Hitler, all they've got is a Sarah Palin.

Bumper sticker spotted the other day: "I Support Meaningless Jingoistic Phrases." It's sad so many people mindlessly echo those phrases and call it debate. Reminds me of the pods in "Invasion of the Body Snatchers." :(

I've been a fan for several years now, and while I am not a fan of your politics, I am always interested in what you have to say. Both sides of this debate have some fair points, as is usually the case, but neither side want to admit that they could be wrong. Bible thumping zealots give conservatives a bad name as much as the "fill in the blank" left wing protesters.

But still, comparing a group of Americans standing up for a pretty good rendition of the second verse of the national anthem to Nazism? Sure, you could say there are some eerie similarities. There are also a lot of similarities between President Obama and several bad figures in human history. Still, he is my President, and while I definitely do not agree with his policies, I will not denigrate him with frivolous comparisons. I will be happy to oppose his actions on their own merit.

Finally, Thank you for allowing replies on a political post. I've wanted to comment for a long time, but political threads are usually closed off. I am sure you don't allow comments on posts like this so you don't have to see all of the 'fringe' people who use any political thread to flame and bash.

George, you have them labeled correctly here.

I love how the Right is always trying to make "formally educated" a bad thing with "elitist" labels. "Elitist"? If anyone wants to see how how open minded the right wing really is, I dare you: google "summer reading list, foxnews.com". The first find is a foxnews.com article on college summer reading.

The list is shown, and is a very broad, very scary *shudder* look at....Seven save us.....multi-cultural and socio-economic studies.
The right wing thinks multicultural studies, environmentalism, food studies, poverty studies, and women's rights are Liberal agenda.
(basically anything that's not written by the Confederacy)

There's your "eyes wide open" Right.

I can always appreciate the sincere patriotism that the Tea Partiers are always eager to express. No one can argue that anyone who ascribes to a political movement or party is doing so because they lack patriotism. But doing so at the expense of including those among your numbers that feel that it is their right to harass and demean others who are rightfully in this country and are due their own rights of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness does not bolster their credibility well for being a movement that acts on the behalf of the 'everyday person' of the United States.

And it's not by action of the 'liberal media' that points this out. Hundreds of thousands of people have seen it for themselves, and have turned around and shown others. You can see YouTube videos, the photos, the soundbytes captured by participants and viewers of the rallies showing the parts of the Tea Party movement that is tolerated by its members.

I just can't comprehend how anyone could tolerate it, and its implications for the Tea Partiers as a whole. I really can't.

Anyone know who the Nazis learned propaganda from?

The only similarities are that the crowds were moved by a great voice. I bet most people that listen to this song don't even catch the "scary" words you speak of.

Saxster, man you give me hope for the future. Keep on preaching the truth.

George, keep cranking out the great books. You and I have some differences though politically. But differences are good and I am glad that we live in the country we do, where at least for now, we can hash them out without fear for repercussion.

"A government which robs Peter to pay Paul, can always count on the support of Paul." – George Bernard Shaw

Nah, the guy is just raising his arm in one of those 'Can I Have An Amen?!' poses. No biggie.

Also, the lyrics are so mild. A small bit about washing away the blood of the enemy. Big deal. Ever read Kipling?

An ex-marine sings the other 3 verses of The Star Spangled Banner at some impotent Tea Party gathering and it is slighty similar to a scene in a movie. The day I worry about that is the day you have my permission to punch me in the bollocks.

Anyone who thinks there is some nascent Nazism proxy readying to take control of hearts and minds and the Supreme Court doesn't have an oita of political savvy in their body.

Chill yer bones, peeps.

It was hate and fear that fueled the Nazi movement. That would be good for the Right and the Left to remember. Instead of calling names and acting hatefully to one another, there needs to be respect for differing views--at the very least, there needs to be respect for and decency in dealing with one another.

Creepy. And Cabaret was probably the most chilling show I've ever seen.

Triumphalism and jingoism are frightening things. The later verses of the Star Spangled Banner are very rousing and probably better written than the first, IMO, but for that they are also all the more creepy.

Cabaret is among my favorite films. I think an even more chilling song was "If You Could See Her," which sort of completed the change in that society we started to see with this song in this scene ("If you could see her through my eyes, she wouldn't look...Jewish, at all," which he sings to someone dressed in a gorilla suit.)