But I would be remiss if I do not at least make passing mention of how depressed, disgusted, and, yes, angry I've become as I watch the ongoing attempts at voter suppression in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida, Iowa, and other states where Republicans and their Teabagger allies control key seats of power.
It is one thing to attempt to win elections. But trying to do so by denying the most basic and important right of any American citizen to hundreds and thousands of people, on entirely spurious grounds... that goes beyond reprehensible. That is despicable.
It would really be nice if there were still some Republicans of conscience out there who would stand up and loudly denounce these efforts, a few men of honor and integrity for whom "win the election" does not "win the election at any cost." There were once many Republicans I admired, even I disagreed with them: men like Everett Dirksen, Clifford Case, Henry Cabot Lodge, William Scranton... yes, even Barry Goldwater, conservative as he is. I do not believe for a moment that Goldwater would have approved of this, any more than Robert A. Heinlein would have. They were conservatives, but they were not bigots, nor racists, nor corrupt. The Vote Suppressors have far more in common with Lester Maddox, George Wallace, John Stennis, and their ilk than they do with their distinguished GOP forebears.
The people behind these efforts at disenfranchising large groups of voters (the young, the old, the black, the brown) are not Republicans, since clearly they have scant regard for our republic or its values. They are oligarchs and racists clad in the skins of dead elephants.
And don't tell me they are libertarians either. No true libertarians would ever support a culture where citizens must "show their papers" to vote or travel. That's a hallmark of a police state, not a free country.
TUESDAY ADDENDUM: Okay, this has been running several days now, has been featured on HUFFINGTON POST and ABC news, referenced on Stephanie Miller, and no doubt countless other people. We have had four hundred messages, and I think everyone has had their say, and everything that needs to be said has been said. Generally eight or ten times. There are plenty of links and references in the comment threads for those who would like to know more about these voter suppression efforts. If you don't want to dig through the links, start with the Brennan Center for Justice and get the facts.
There's no sense in letting this spin on in circles forever. I am locking comments. Back to Westeros and worldcon and similar subjects, boys and girls.
Thanks for listening.
- Current Location:High Dudgeon
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Profile
grrm- George R.R. Martin
- George R. R. Martin
Page Summary
- trooper6 : (no subject) [+2]
- scriptbabe : Start Here for Documentation [+0]
- scriptbabe : Thank you [+0]
- embers_log : (no subject) [+0]
Denise Christensen : You gotta think [+12] 
SNOzero : What is the solution? [+9] - Euler Ferrer Jr : (no subject) [+0]
- fanoffun : (no subject) [+7]
- skydiver119 : (no subject) [+1]
- gopherstwinsfan : Tea bagging [+9]
- pbagosy : (no subject) [+4]
- usul_md : Interesting... [+2]
- dalimar2 : I don't get what the big deal is [+1]
- dalimar2 : Third World System [+0]
- burley8344 : politics [+2]
- ayashi : (no subject) [+0]
- smofbabe : (no subject) [+0]
- kulyok : (no subject) [+1]
- fan_of_happosai : (no subject) [+0]
- think4yerslf : Voter ID nonsense [+12]
- winterwarrior : Republican Tactics [+5]
- badluddite : Voter ID and the Poll Tax [+0]
- journeywoman : (no subject) [+0]
- Jose Sarmento : Still don't get the anti-ID stance... [+0]
Daniel Colton : Disagree / Partial [+0]
Comments
I find most fantasy novels to be troubling in their adoration of authoritarianism (usually in the form of monarchy), militarism, worth being hereditary, disregard for poor people, and other questionable values (many of which the current crop of republicans are espousing). Your novels don't do those things. It is why I love them so, I why this post does not surprise me...rather I can just be delighted by it.
Bravo, sir!
Mind you, there are certain themes that are universal -- musings on power, justice, the purpose of government -- and those will inevitably be a part of any book that treats with kings and wars, etc.
http://www.brennancenter.org/content/se
And I do have the "qualifications" you demand. I was an attorney with a speciality in Constitutional law. Now I'm "just a writer" so you may choose to discount me, but I urge you to follow the links and analysis of the Brennan Center.
Thank you for your eloquent post. This is a terrifying assault on a right that is fundamental to our Constitution and democracy, and frankly, it's scaring the hell out of me.
I understand that Nixon was totally convinced that Kennedy stole the 1960 election with voter fraud in Chicago (and I don't know that he was wrong), and many Republicans from his administration felt that ANYTHING was fair after that.
The purging of legal voters from the registered voter lists in Florida were the reason Bush won in 2000 (along with a corrupt Supreme Court). And there was real evidence of Bush's Republicans in Ohio stealing that state to insure his election 2004 with gerry-rigged electronic voting machines. This is just the next step in their (evident) sense that anything they can get away with, they should.
Study after study has shown that voter fraud occurs at levels so small as to insignificant.
The answer is not to accept that illegal votes will count.
The answer is also not to suppress legal citizens from voting.
So what is a good solution to ensure that each voter is a legal citizen of the US and entitled to vote in the US, in their state, in their county?
Study after study has shown that voter fraud occurs at levels so small as to insignificant.
Should we disenfranchise millions to prevent the malfeasance of dozens?
This is the same group that hijacked the legit grass roots tea party movement whose only focus was to limit growth of government. But has turned into a platform of a bunch of extreme right wing xenophobes.
This is a pure power grab.
As a Marine Corps vet of Iraq and Afgan, I will defend any citizens right to vote. However ,I'm sorry but I can't see anything wrong with asking to see a DL or SSC before voting.
The argument that people cannot afford it, is absurd. I'm for giving out free Id's or SC cards if by some chance someone cannot afford it. I was raised extremely poor and still found a way. If a person slams both sides, I'm with them but if a person fully backs one side, I began to question their intellect. Not being able to afford an ID is the weakest argument I've heard since Bush's argument for war with Iraq. If we cannot wake up from the brainwash perpetrated by News media than we deserve a huge, corrupt government. We have drones watching every move we make. We have a government monitoring our every word or action online. We have an illegal federal reserve inflating our money.
I say let whoever marry that wants to.
Let people do whatever drug fancies them as long as it does not harm anyone else.
Let people say anything they want.
Keep government hands off of the Internet.
Get rid of the FR and IRS. Eliminate all tax with the exception of a sales tax.
Incorporate technology into voting and let the people vote on everything that effects them.
Throw out lobbyist and force all representatives to live amongst their constituents. They can vote from home through a secure Internet connection.
Instead of one president, go with two, the way the early Roman republic did.
Oh, and figure out a way to verify the legal status of voters.
And maybe ten tribunes too, every one of them with an absolute right to veto any law they did not like.
The libertarian's dream. Nothing would ever get done.
Of course, you seem a well-read guy, you DO know that the Roman Republic ultimately collapsed and gave way to the Principate and the Empire? And not because of the orgies, as the Christian Right whackos would have you believe. It was because the ossified Republican system with those two consuls and ten tribunes made it next to impossible for the government actually to address any of the social problems that were arising...
So instead of taxes and land reform, the horrors the conservative elements of the Republic wanted to prevent, we got bread, circuses, civil war, and five hundred years of imperial rule.
I think the bigger issue isn't as much the voter ID as it is the corruption of our general system. Popular votes don't even count in the end. The President is chosen by the electoral college. I know that, as a moderate, my vote literally doesn't count because all our electoral votes go republican. always, without question. (to the point that the candidates don't even campaign here...mixed blessing, we're spared the crap of ads but also know that they don't give a damn about us cause we don't have enough votes to matter, and we're a sure bet anyway)
Wanna level the playing field? disband the electoral college, let us choose our Prez 100% on popular vote and maybe a lot of these hyper conservative bigots will find out just how small of a faction they really are.
Gonna be hard to do, they've spent decades and decades rigging the system (just like our corporations have to avoid paying the taxes they SHOULD be paying), but the electoral college needs to go away. Then maybe we can work on stuff like a flat tax and EVERYONE paying their fair share, instead of the Prince John syndrome we have going on now.
Name calling and false accusations in general do nothing but serve to stir up and further divide us. If we want true hope and change in this country, we need to work together and have honest discussions and debates about the issues. And we need to elect politicians who are not self serving. I agree with your point that some politicians want to win at all costs, but it's not just the Republican party. The Democrats are just as guilty. So let's stop squabbling about the Rs and the Ds and try to find some real solutions.
To be sure, they only used the word for a couple of days, until Keith Obermann and other talking heads on MSNBC began to make relentless fun of them for the coinage. Then they hurriedly retreated, and adopted a "no, no, don't call us that" stance.
Which I was willing to respect, as far as that goes... until they decided to gild the lily with a little denial, and started rewriting history, saying, "No, we NEVER called ourselves that, that was all made up by the media." That part was just a flat out lie. I saw and heard tea party guys proudly calling themselves "teabaggers" with my very own ears and eyes, so I don't like being told it never happened. One guy I remember especially vividly, since he was wearing a hat with a dozen tea bags dangling down from it.
I hate Newspeak.
Edited at 2012-08-13 04:09 am (UTC)
So, in order to stop a problem they admit doesn't exist, Republicans passed a law that would stop 1 in 10 voters from exercising their Constitutional rights, and, funny story!, that 1 in 10 happen to vote almost consistently Democratic.
America!
Imagine for instance that someone, I don't know, decided to turn a blind eye to illegal immigration. They could claim that the problem is fixed. But wait. If the other side takes control in November, the game will change.
All of sudden it will be the cons that are guilty of voter fraud and easy on the border. The never ending cycle.
They will keep distracting the sheep from the real objectives. Oh, look at the pretty shiny object but ignore the guy stealing your wallet. That guy over there punches kittens. I'm just trying to feed the starving grandma living in the alley. Point is, their is always a hidden motive behind every political action. The cons are not alone garbage. The libs are not alone garbage. Both are equally garbage. Mind you, their is a considerable amount of perfume sprayed to mask the smell but if your eyes work, you are foolish not to see both crawling out of the trash can. One day, a strange man or woman arrives out of nowhere with actual solutions. Neither party likes that person. "They will ruin everything. Get our cronies in the media to bash and make fun of them. The people will eat dog food if it's served with fries."
Advice, if you are willing. Find someone that both parties hate and throw all your support behind that person.
Turn off your TV and ignore commentators. They are all biased and none care a bit about your plight.
If I could be so bold. I will quote a legend. "Open your mind, Open your mind, Open your mind, Open your mind, Open your mind."
- Kuato, Total recall.
LBJ would never have passed any of his landmark civil rights legislation without Dirksen, for instance.
I get it that the very poor or some legal immigrants may not have a state issue ID, but I don't think the solution is to use the honor system for voting, and stick our heads in the sand like ostriches and pretend voting fraud does not exist. You yourself, GRRM, have joked on your blog that the Chicago way is to vote early and often, so you must know it exists to joke about it.
As far as I know only states with a history of slavery have to get permission from the feds to change voter ID laws, all the northern and western states can do so as they please, and I'm sure I can't be the only one living in a state that has had photo ID requirements for years.
Why not give people the benefit of the doubt and assume they merely want to stop voting fraud. Maybe you think this is the wrong way to stop voting fraud. Okay, what is your solution then? The honor system doesn't work, we need some system. If a photo ID isn't good enough, why not give some token when you register to vote or something. Mail a single use swipe card and outsource verification to VISA (who processes billions of transactions securely every year). The left will say the right is just trying to disenfranchise people, the right will say the left just wants to commit voter fraud. Lets assume both want honest and legal elections and figure out a system that is both open and secure.
I live in California and we do not have to show ID in order to vote and the honor system works fine for us.
However... third world countries don't have absentee voting and we do, so how would you prevent people from voting by mail and then a second time in person? You'd have to address that.
It also wouldn't stop the fraud where people in uncompetitive districts or states are bussed to competitive ones.
But purple fingers would stop the easiest and most common fraud, if it stops the left/right silliness I'd be willing to deal with an indigo index finger, much to the chagrin of the anti-indigo crowd at WiC I'm sure.
Regardless, good points on both sides as usual - but I have to go conservative this time. I truly am an independent.
Being from Chicago - I WISH someone would do something about voter ID - we really have too many dead people voting - seriously.
Also getting tired of people having excuse after excuse NOT to do something like be able to identify themselves. The bleeding hearts out there fall for it every time - must be that liberal guilt trip again.
No one is disenfranchising anyone - just asking for a little responsibility from people who would prefer not to have any.
2) Stop the racism rants, all of you on the left. Take a second and look up the word "dissent" in the dictionary. I am a republican-leaning libertarian. I disagreed with policies under Carter and Clinton. I disagree with those same ideas/policies under Obama. I did not get called a racist for dissent until Obama was elected/inaugurated. There is a big difference. Unless I say something like "I don't like ___ policy because Obama is nothing but a stupid [racial slur I won't say]" you cannot call me a racist. Can you not counter my arguments of small government, low taxes, and personal responsibility that you need to try to throw me onto one of the third rails of politics (race)? I had hoped someone who WRITES for a living would be a little more... IMAGINATIVE in formulating an argument to convince me that I'm in the wrong.
In my neighborhood growing up, we all knew each other, the world has changed. I doubt you would recognize me walking down the street, even if I lived on your block.
It's easy to pick nits in the peanut gallery. How do you propose to 1) keep voter fraud from happening, and 2) not falling afoul of your police state argument?
Mr. Martin – you must “show your papers” (passport) when you fly international, right? Last time I flew to Asia on business I had to keep my “papers” with me at all times in each foreign country I visited. Oh the horror, the shame and disgrace, it was truly a horrendous experience! Every time I make a deposit at my local bank, I have to “show my papers” (photo ID) to the clerk to get a receipt with a balance on it. Last year I bought a car, and those damn Nazi-Ford credit guys MADE me “show my papers” to get the car registered! Can you believe it?! And what about that neo-fascist Obama? Did you know that a person MUST “show their papers” to a bunch of thugs with automatic weapons at the gate to even get into see the One speak these days? No ID, no-get-to-see-Obama-speak. It’s truly unbelievable! I mean, it would really be nice is some Democrats would get rid of all these photo-ID requirements at all of these bigoted, racist sponsored speaking events!
Now Mr. Martin, if voting in our elections is our “most basic and important” right, and I agree 100%, voting is much MUCH more important than getting on an airplane, buying a car, taking out a loan or attending a political rally – then why should we be LESS vigilant at insuring the eligibility of voters than we are of all of these other actions? The only obvious explanation for why Democrats don’t want such miniscule, common sense, free, proof of ID requirements put in place for voting is that they intend to stuff the ballot with invalid votes.
By the way, I am very glad to hear of your admiration of Barry Goldwater, no doubt you would vote for him were he still running for office. (color me skeptical)
Thank God you’re “way too busy for political rants” these days is all I can say.
I hate all that crap too.
I don't know how old you are... but I am old enough to remember when none of this was true. Even in the late 60s and early 70s, when I reached my young adulthood, I could pay my hotel bill at worldcon with a personal check (and did), buy my tickets at the airport with a personal check (ditto), walk onto my flight without being scanned, stapled, and anally probed. In the bank, my teller greeted me by name. I never had to show my driver's license at ANY of these places. Which is a good thing, since I did not have one. I did not learn to drive until my late 20s, when I moved to Iowa.
We have lost so much personal freedom... and often it seems to me that the younger generation does not even realize it. In the world they know, "show your papers" has become routine.
Fox "news" is not as bad as you say it is - they have broken stories you would NEVER have heard abpout in the "mainstream media" I do not recall them ever having to issue an apology or retraction either.
Fox "opinion" shows are a different matter - Hannity being a prime example of partisanship. Kinda like the entire NBC news division.
My national ID card has my name (no address), photo (which is not stored in a registry I believe, just for face-to-name matching when you present the card), fingerprint (ibid, except if you have a criminal record), and my taxpayer's / social security / national ID number and date of birth. We can use it in a bar to prove our age (not that I've been asked in quite a while...), we can use it to get a passport, to get health care, to vote, to pay taxes, to apply for a pension or to pick it up from the post office, to open a bank account...
Sure, my name and numbers information are stored somewhere, but neither myself nor - seriously - anyone I know feels in the least that their freedom is hamstrung by the card in any way.
IMHO the benefits far outweigh the downsides... and it feels a bit of an oversimplification to say "We don't need a "solution" since we do not have a problem." and then end up resorting to the DL for the myriad of very plausible daily life situations where a national ID card would come in handy.
Everything else you said - I'm with you. :)
Disagreement with required ID.
Disagreement with the timing.
The timing can't be defended. With elections so close, efforts to target certain voting blocks is just obvious maliciousness.
But with the ID issue, I find that another can of worms. I'm for having a government ID be presented to vote. I get that some people are afraid that ID will grow into a tool that will get leveraged and used by an evil government. Ok, so lets make the ID simple/basic. No RFID's, innert paper with it's fancy water marks, etc.
If you're afraid you're giving up liberty and privacy by being required to have an ID then you obviously aren't weighing that fear against other very real fears. Just go ahead and leave the fraud door open on elections and you'll see that votes get cast in directions you don't agree with either. Now you've got law and leaders hijacked out from under you. And you let it happen.
Wave good-bye to your liberty.
Having a government ID in everyone's hands has pros and cons. I'm giving an anecdotal example of how everyone having an ID would protect at least one of our liberties. The preserved power of my one vote.