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Autograph Hounds

For all of you autograph collectors out there...

My partner in crime Gardner Dozois is cleaning out his house in scenic Philadelphia, and he just send me two big boxes of OLD MARS and OLD VENUS hardcovers, all signed.

I've added my own illegible scrawl to the title pages, to go with his.

Since Gardner and I live two thousand miles apart, getting a copy of one of our anthologies signed by both of us is not easy. So here's your chance.

Matching copies of OLD MARS and OLD VENUS signed by both editors can be purchased (while the supply lasts, which may not be long) from the Jean Cocteau bookstore, at:

Lots of other autographed books are available from the same site, of course, including titles by Diana Gabaldon, Ellen Datlow, Lisa See, Carrie Vaughn. Junot Diaz, Lev Grossman, Dennis Lehane, and that George R.R. Martin guy.


Jun. 9th, 2015 01:52 pm (UTC)
Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
Hello, I'm an administrator for Game of Thrones Wiki, devoted to the TV series.

We've...run into a bit of a problem which I realize you really aren't at much liberty to discuss.

Starting with the episode "Hardhome", the TV writers have started openly referring to the White Walker leader as "the Night King". Back in Season 4 the online guide also briefly listed him as "The Night's King" but was hastily taken down, apparently a leak. The online guide now calls him "The Night King".

Everyone in the media is now assuming that this "Night King" is the SAME character as the legendary "Night's King" fought by Joramun 8,000 years ago. I'm concerned if it's just a TITLE, like "Storm King", so there can be more than one - given that it was said the Night's King was killed.

Now I want to ask "are these indeed the same character?" but I know you probably won't reveal upcoming book material. Better phrasing might be "is it appropriate to treat these as one character on a single article on the wiki, or should we split it into two articles? Or at least two sections on the same article?"

Well, you probably can't answer that as of yet.

One thing I do hope you CAN answer: Benioff and Weiss, the online guide, and even the actor Ross Mullan who plays one of the other White Walkers, CONSISTENTLY refer to him as "The Night King" - without a possessive "S". So my question is, is there *any* significance to that distinction, or can the two terms be used interchangeably?

Side question we've having trouble with on the wiki: in episode 9, Mace Tyrell refers to "Maegor the Third", and clearly describes him as a king of the Seven Kingdoms. There are three possibilities: 1 - the actor flubbed the line and meant "Maegor the Cruel", 2 - the script intentionally wrote Mace making a mistake, trying to depict him as a bumbling fool getting his facts wrong, or 3 - the writers intentionally wanted to introduce TWO separate kings onto the Iron Throne. Given that we have a full listing of kings that is difficult.

Some over on the wiki are arguing that yes, we should treat this as that a "King Maegor III" existed in the TV continuity" - either that Benioff and Weiss intentionally invented him, or, the belief that he automatically gets created due to a script error (sort of like in Seinfeld, saying that the "Moops" must exist because "Moors" got misprinted on a Trivial Pursuit card).

I would have just assumed it was an error. Can you confirm via contacts if "Maegor III" was an error? (Either in or out of universe?)

Thank you for your time.
Jun. 9th, 2015 05:08 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
I suspect that "Maegor III" was a mistake, though I cannot say for certain. Perhaps a flubbed line, as you suggest. It is true that the Targaryen succession on the series is different than the one in the novels; most notably, the Mad King's father Jaehaerys II was dropped, as was established way back in season one. In much the same way as the Rhoynar have been dropped from the royal titles, "King of Andals and the Rhoynar and the First Men," etc.

These changes were simplifications, however. The books are very complex, but the practical limits of a television series call for a bit more simplicity. Dropping a king or two accomplishes that.

ADDING kings, however, would be a step in the opposite direction, which is why I think "Maegor III" had to be a mistake. And not one that was in the scripts, I would guess. Bryan Cogman, who is the Keeper of the Continuity on the series, knows the names of the Targaryen kings as well as I do.

Of course, it could also be a subtle bit of characterization, as you suggest, intended to show that Mace is an idiot who does not know his Westerosi history. (Not a mistake that Book Mace would make, but the character in the show combines Mace with Harys Swyft, and actually seems more like the latter).

All this, of course, is surmise on my part. You would have to ask David or Dan or Bryan for a more definitive answer.

In the book canon, of course, there has only been only King Maegor, the reputation of Maegor the Cruel being so black. England has had only one King John, for much the same reasons. (Prince Aerion Brightflame did name his son Maegor, but that was meant as a provocation, and in any case the boy never sat the Iron Throne).

As for the Night's King (the form I prefer), in the books he is a legendary figure, akin to Lann the Clever and Brandon the Builder, and no more likely to have survived to the present day than they have.
Jun. 9th, 2015 05:28 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
Thank you for responding, ser.

Actually I have been trying to flag down Mr. Cogman via his twitter account but he hasn't answered my question re Maegor III (I'm "ADragonDemands" on Twitter because "The Dragon Demands" was too long).

Oh yes, I've also been trying to get in touch with Cogman re removing Jaehaerys II, and he actually responded to my question once submitted to a Q&A on a fansite, but I asked "has Jaehaerys II been removed and how does this affect how the Targaryens intermarried with the Baratheons? The Wiki can't draw a full Targaryen family tree until we know that" and his simple answer was "yes, Jaehaerys II has been removed". Ack. I think that's in limbo state until they can figure out the after-effects (i.e. inventing "Viola Redwyne" instead of Egg's fourth son who was a homosexual). Crud.

Elio and Linda of Westeros.org discussed this in their video review of the episode; Linda flew into a curse-laden rant demanding to know who the heck Maegor III was, her wrath terrible to behold (which is why I love Elio and Linda).

I'm not even going to touch upon the Martell family tree problems: okay now they've established that Ellaria is mother of four out of eight Sand Snakes (and they confirmed there are eight)...then they made Tyene sort of a combination of book-Tyene and book-Elia Sand (fair enough, condensation will happen in adaptation)....but four plus Tyene equals five. So what, Obella now isn't her daughter or something? Who knows. Apparently quite a few more Sand Snake scenes were filmed for Season 5 (as we know from promo pics) but they were cut for time.

I'm also excited they mentioned the Dance of the Dragons this episode and gave a succinct explanation of it - I hope it's a prequel project hook (like, ten years from now).

While I'm on the subject...we have no idea why Jon Snow and the wildlings arrive at the north gate of Castle Black when they were seen leaving Hardhome by ship, and would have just been deposited back at Eastwatch on the SOUTH side of the Wall. Elio and Linda similarly confused. Was this officially due to the rewrites which we heard happened that expanded the Hardhome scene? (originally it was briefly going to be in Iceland, but later expanded so much they built it in the same quarry as Castle Black).

Oh yes, we also noticed that "of the Rhoynar" thing. Problem is that they actually called Daenerys "Queen of the Andals, the Rhoynar, and the First Men" in the Season 4 finale...even though Missandei herself had referred to her without "of the Rhoynar" earlier that same season, and Tommen wasn't called "of the Rhoynar" at his own coronation when Oberyn was standing in front of him. Our suspicion is they cut it out because back in the first episode Eddard said it and they were having enough trouble explaining who "Andals" and "First Men" are, didn't want to deluge audience with information (so they really only even mention "Dorne" starting in Season 4). I don't know if they can easily retcon that, though.

These are things I worry about constantly. I'm an obsessive internet fan who works on an online encyclopedia about this material - we have *lists* of these things. I've been trying to flag down Cogman for years but always they elude my grasp. He tasks me, he tasks me - but I shall have him. If I have to chase him round the isle of Leng, and round the Ibbenese maelstrom, and through Valyria's flames, I will not give him up!
Felipe Bini
Jun. 9th, 2015 06:38 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
It's also odd that while the Rhoynar have been dropped from the royal titles (even in Doran's toast to Tommen), in last season's episode "The Children" Missandei refers to Daenerys as "Queen of the Andals, the Rhoynar and the First Men". Also a mistake?
Jun. 9th, 2015 08:47 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
They also added another king in the show, Orys I.
Jun. 9th, 2015 09:58 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
Oh, "Orys I". Elio Garcia told us to disregard him as an early Storm King or something, so now we treat him as "Orys I Durrandon". Problem is that in this episode Mace clearly said that "Maegor III" ruled over all of the Seven Kingdoms.
Jun. 9th, 2015 11:12 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
Are you implying Mace Tyrell is far more astute than he lets on?
Jun. 9th, 2015 11:32 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
"I have it on good authority that Inspector Clouseau is anything but an imbecile. That he only *plays* the fool." -- Return of the Pink Panther
Jun. 9th, 2015 11:56 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
You really think poor Ser Harys is as stupid as TV Mace?! Even Joffrey seems to know that there were only five King Aegons...

Anyway, since the whole Byron Swann vs. Vhagar thing was discussed in this series I thought I could add the question which dragon actually fried that guy in the books? Haldon Halfmaester also cites Grand Maester Munkun's The Dance of the Dragons - A True Telling on the subject, however Tyrion, being a smart ass, comes up with a convincingly sounding explanation that the dragon in question was actually Rhaenyra's Syrax since Vhagar was ridden by Prince Aemond, and Storm's End was for Aegon II during the Dance.

TWoIaF and TPatQ have given us some details on the Baratheon involvement during the war (Borros the Illiterate allowing himself to be fooled by his maester and stuff) but from what we know it seems unlikely that Ser Byron would have had a deadly encounter with either Vhagar nor Syrax during the war. As far as we know Rhaenyra's Syrax was only on Dragonstone and then in KL after the city was taken by the Blacks, while Vhagar and Aemond were apparently received friendly by the Baratheons at Storm's End - so it seems actually quite unlikely that a Swann would have the opportunity or the intention to attack either dragon.

That is - unless Byron Swann was some a covert Green in Rhaenyra's service or a covert Black in service of Aegon II and had thus the opportunity to attack either Vhagar or Syrax in the service of the other faction. Even more interesting would it be if Rhaenyra and her guys had actually fought a short campaign in the Stormlands at one point during the war to punish those who had a hand in Luke's death.

I'm just bringing this up because it is quite interesting that a guy like Byron Swann should ever grow to TV fame. We should really know who really killed that poor fool...
Jun. 10th, 2015 01:38 pm (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King
Actually World reveals there were some covert attacks against Dragonstone, that's how the Cargyll brothers bought it.
Jun. 10th, 2015 04:17 pm (UTC)
Folks, I think George the Clever may have just subtly hinted that Bran the Builder (Coldhands?) and Lann the Clever (?) have still "survived to the present day" along with the Night's King. Notice he didn't say "still alive," because it is questionable whether the undead are still alive. Whether I am finding a hint where none was intended or not, you are the man, George!
Jun. 11th, 2015 08:09 am (UTC)
Re: Game of Thrones Wiki re Night's King


George R.R. Martin
George R. R. Martin

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April 2018



  • grrm
    5 Mar 2018, 19:17
    Still working on that. When we have a final, I will share it.
  • grrm
    5 Mar 2018, 05:32
    All the Wild Cards books under Tor have had absolutely stellar covers. I'd frame them and hang them on my wall if I could.
  • grrm
    4 Mar 2018, 03:28
    Are all these examples digital artwork? It doesn't look like traditional oil on canvas. I miss the fantasy/sci-fi covers of the '70s and '80s. Even the paperbacks had amazing covers.
  • grrm
    3 Mar 2018, 17:49
    Whatever anyone can get their hands on is, I suspect, the right answer.

    At the last party, it was an open bar with pretty much everything you can imagine on offer. There were some special drinks as…
  • grrm
    3 Mar 2018, 00:07
    Any chance you could tell us who’s doing the cover art for Fire and Blood? And maybe when we can expect a glimpse of it. Thank you!
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